Prorealtime v12 user created Indicators disappear

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Viewing 14 posts - 1 through 14 (of 14 total)
  • 05/10/2024 at 8:39 AM #232520
    ojutan

    Hi,

    I want to report an UGLY issue with the indicators, Proraltime V12 with IG.com

    • I duplicate an indicator named , change it e.g. it’s name  to _FK01_v2and some of the parameters to be suited to a certain instrument I want to robo trade
    • I use the save frunction of the platform
    • I even exported this indicator
    • I integrate the indicator into probacktest, I see that it acts as I want, the equity curve tells me that my approach is profitable
    • I create an automated trading system from it
    • I start the trading system to see if it has a “first run problem” but it’s active for hours, executed once a minute.
    • As the conditions in the indicator ( a “signal”) happes only once a day or even once within 2 days I just let it run (on my demo account)

    Some days later I start Prorealtime and I go to “Indicators” and MY INDICATOR _FK01_v2 IS MISSING  I always take care that I am in the demo account and not into the life account as this can be costly if something wents wrong.

    When going into the probacktest I see that it should have had three trades but the automated trading system did not trade. Then I wanted to check the indicator on my iustrument (here XAGUSD 1 $ contract) and in the chart my indicator is missing… it also does not appear in my list of indicators. The trading system exists, the indicator doesnt. I also exported the trading system and it exports the indicator as well…

    1.) the indicator missing issue gets really annoying. In the indicators list is a duplicate function, then I can rename it but there is no save function. As this is vital for r developers (and for testing a trading strategy before creating a trading system with the indicator’s code inside).

    The platform has a save function… but it seems indicators are stored client side for  a while. Sometimes this works sometime it doesnt. I made 13 indicators and one does not show up.

    Same problems with ProBacktest… when I dont create an automated trading system my new trade system has gone. It’s missing.

    Maybe I do miss something in the GUI? I have created around 12 indicators with a new approach on trading, each version was better and I learned early that I have to export them to keep a copy …

    2.) Does the Demo account for IG.COM behave differently from the life account in CFD contract trading? Is it restrictred to some instruments? I could even go to my other Prorealtime account with interactive brokers and trade the instrument directly becaues it has 20x margin in the demo account (and 1.8x margin with no intraday fees)  but then for rare metals storage fees do apply which I dont have with the CFD so trading rare metal CFDs intraday is cheaper on IG.com… expecially if I cancel the “sponsored” mode, and pay the 29 or 79 Euro monthly by myself.

    With an experimental or even a commercial indicator or trading system I usually make a test run with the demo account for a week efore I think about integrating this into the life account (and think about paying for it). I have already found indicators called “robotrading something” but not able to run in automatic trading systems.

    05/10/2024 at 9:26 AM #232521
    GraHal

    Are you 100% sure you clicked on ‘Save and Exit’ before closing your PRT Platform … see attached at yellow arrowhead.

    05/10/2024 at 11:21 AM #232523
    PeterSt

    Hello ojutan,

    You are correct the the more than lousy “save” functionality of PRT. But :

    ojutan wrote:

    I even exported this indicator

    With this you imply that even now it is lost. If this is really what you wanted to bring across, then you must look into your PC environment, because this won’t get lost. What can have happened, however, is that you think the Indicator gets saved with Exporting the Strategy itself, while this is not so (if you ask me).

    Anyway, as said, you are right in the saving issues (10fold worse than you just described).
    Peter

     

    PS:

    GraHal wrote:

    Are you 100% sure you clicked on ‘Save and Exit’ before closing your PRT Platform … see attached at yellow arrowhead.

    GraHal, that does not matter in the circumstance that PRT exits itself (after 18 hours). Then you will again have lost all. Anyway, No, in that case ojutan will not have used that button. 🙂

     

    05/10/2024 at 2:40 PM #232530
    ojutan

    Thanks for your answers… I use the file / save function and I expect that in this moment all of my work is transferred from Prorealtime application to the server.

    This mostly works but sometimes fails.

    And I quite every session I have with save and exit…

    Of course I exported it because this is not the first time where this happens to me, but the first time where I paid attention and yes it was the close-to-be final code and I wanted to apply it to a  different Prorealtime account. I have two of them so exchange of data is vital to me… indicators seem to be account bound, which is partially good and partially bad. E.g. many indicator and trade robot vendors do not deploy a demo at all… but the full version I must have in the demo first, as no indicator works well in the future if it’s programming is not perfect. Many of them are “ai assisted” as many people read about the ChatGPT “prompt” to make it program but the programs themselves do not have access to AI functions…

    Btw my algorithms do exist on paper too, as I did physical / sensor measurement  algorithm programming for 6 years the first approach is to write down a strategy and  a formula and how to apply / simplify it with only a hand fulof points with values. And I did Basic from 1982 (as a 10 yo kid) till today, around 25 years of experience helps me a lot to detect and bypass some software glitches.

     

    05/11/2024 at 7:35 PM #232556
    codeguru

    The trading system and the indicator remain invisible in the “indicators” (then trading systems) and it is only visible through “trading” “PRo Order Auto Trading”. I just got noticed that the trading system finally opened a position (on the demo account) so I checked… trading – pro order auto trading – there it is. But it is missing in the “indicators” menu and the trading system does not show up in that gui too. And I can see it on the chart where I ran the pro backtest.

    Beacuse this happens with the software running in German and Prorealtime has no feature to change the language I will post a request in the german forum or  contact the support directly.

    I consider this to be a very serious issue… I code since I am 12, code for 15 min, save, compile, test is in my blood,  and ran through all kind of IDE, starting with Borland Turbo Pascal, Watcom, Eclipse, several ecommerce building tools like Dreamweaver, Intershop builder, J builder and finally since 2002 Visual Studio. I cant believe that things like this happen…

     

    05/11/2024 at 9:04 PM #232557
    GraHal

    Did you export the strategy to your PC?

    Have you tried importing that same strategy from your PC to PRT Platform?

    When I do above, for strategies using a ‘personal Indicator’ … this personal indicator is shown at the bottom of the strategy code.

    05/12/2024 at 12:19 AM #232562
    PeterSt

    It is fairly easy to create the situation that Strategy code (and Indicators) is completely missing, BUT runs in ProOrder. Just hand it to ProOrder and next quit the platform without saving.

    05/12/2024 at 8:45 AM #232564
    GraHal

    Why would anyone knowingly do that, given that the default via File > Quit is Save and Exit.

    05/12/2024 at 10:06 AM #232569
    PeterSt

    Just read again, have some additional coffee and get the gist ?
    It is the means to prove that things disappear while they are actually in use already (I think that the OP tells this too).
    All what needs to happen for reality is that the 18 hours pass … (which now annoyingly pops up and greys all out ay hour #16).

    PS: It looks like you hardly run into that 18 hours limit, hence that you sleep too long and shut off PRT prior to that. Not everybody does that, or he may fall asleep unforeseen. This latter is all me (but will still enough coffee – depends on the uptime. 🙂 ).

    05/12/2024 at 10:28 AM #232574
    GraHal

    Yes you are correct, I never hit the 18 hour limit as my PC is switched off every night before my all-important sleeptime!!!

    ojutan wrote:

    I use the save frunction of the platform I even exported this indicator

    What I can’t understand is … if you exported the Indicator, why can you not find it again on your PC?
    Have you used e-search on your PC … maybe you saved the Indicator not where you have been looking??

    05/12/2024 at 11:19 AM #232575
    PeterSt

    Personally I think this could be the xth thread about something which can’t be solved because die-hard coders who know how to work(-flow), can not adapt to how the prehistory of PRT presents things in their modern way.

    Didn’t I tell it the other day ? it has become sheer impossible to justify to PRT-newcomers all the do’s and don’ts which are out of this world. In the end such a newcomer is down on the floor, startled with the impossibility for him or her to understand all this madness.
    This is how I personally interpret ojutan’s postings; there’s so few logic in all that you (he) can’t know what he did any more. Fact is that I too made the remark about the “exporting”. But mind you, that is/was in the midst of the idea that an Indicator exports with it, which certainly can happen (don’t ask me when it does and when not, but envision the indicator as a separate entity which … can already exist where you re-import it – it is messy to say the least).

    This could be my last “kicking” post, because while previously (many years by now !) I could have the idea it would help in the very end, I now know it definitely won’t. Nothing changes and the quality only goes down hill. It feels like at the PRT end someone (the owner) is waiting it out and there is no follow up.

    05/12/2024 at 11:31 AM #232577
    GraHal
    PeterSt wrote:

    don’t ask me when it does and when not,

    I thought Indicators get auto-written into the code when exporting to PC if the Indicator is a personal / non-PRT Indicator?

    I have yet to find on my many Strategies an example to test out my theory.

    My assumption is based on the fact that PRT provided Indicators will always be available on PRT Platfrom as default and so there is no need to auto-write PRT Indicators into Strategy code when exporting a Strategy to PC.

    05/12/2024 at 5:50 PM #232586
    PeterSt

    Try several accounts. Export from the one, import to the other.
    Also, an Indicator is a separate entity for a reason. Within ICT we call that Normalisation. It shouldn’t even be saved along with a Strategy. An Indicator in relationship to a Strategy is 1:n. So I change Strategy B and with that Indicator 99 which is also used in Strategy A ? then what if it’s saved along with Strategy A while Indicator 99 required a change on behalf of Strategy A ? would you allow Strategy B to fail ?

    Btw, I was not saying that it is saved along-with. Only that it shouldn’t … (and hopefully doesn’t). And so … the OP may also wonder whether he actually saved that Indicator. Het should have exported *that* if it’s lost now.

    Something else I have been saying more often : The Save features of PRT are full with hidden dimensions. Some things should be saved-along, some things explicitly should not. It really is complicated, if you ask me. But that is something else than losing codes because a save function is wacky in the midst of all else (the 18 hour stuff ahead of all). So many things in this realm are never being solved (never means : after 5 years of continuous complaint and accompanied with dozens (!!) of emails with examples on one subject (out of say 25+).
    But G-D, if I use the Save option, SAVE IT. Save it instead of applying your hobby horse of working in some failing cloud. It does not work (at all) since I am here and longer (2017).

    Mind you, what we call “save” is often just disappearance. Ever noticed disappearing Detailed Reports and their settings ? happens only with PRT-IG. If I did not save a backup-copy, I will have lost them. And when does that happen ? no idea. Once per x months. You could say it did not save them. But they some times all disappear (all is 8 or so) and *that* is saved. Thank you !
    Not.

    05/21/2024 at 11:12 AM #232860
    ojutan

    well the issue is  NOT solved… I expect that an individual indicator is saved when I click on the “save” function. And it does with a success rate of 90%. And there are other places like the ProScreener GUI… there isnt a save button at all  if you chnage a region and the stock excahnge it is also forgotten if you dont click on the ProScreener button below 🙁

    If someone tells me that I have to save and exit Prorealtime every time when I change code… well that’s a bad opinion on users. That’s a time consuming procedure, as startup / shutdown of Prorealtime takes a while.

    The “missing indicator” was the issue and nothing else… the 18 hour shutdown is just something else  which is quite annoying as this effectively stops me from alarm based trading on a market that is open 0:00-23:00 this must also be taken into consideration, as the significant market movements do happen between 2 and 5 am CEST, possibly traders  from asian time zones… T here are some (paid) indicators on the marketplace which seem to rely on historic chart data (for example if I have a 10K candle chart there it will read them all and self optimize it’s trading strategy)  and for that reason I cannot use them into a trading system and for that reason I think you should let the user decide… MT4 / MT5 is explicitely made for 24/7 operation but it’s trading system is in the software and not in the MT backend.

    Unless I have a 1 million tick chart it wont eat up my memory and thereby my performance 🙂

     

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